Question:
the person of the previous message said: "I’m mostly looking for something outside the standard 3-chord 4/4 box when I’m ready to listen. " you definitely should check out some metal then… — TomB Proud endorser of Jupiler beer. http://www.duskmetal.be Drank en AC/DC, slecht voor de conditie (Hugo Matthysen)
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Mark Keith heard this from a drunken, unemployed, washed up dot com exec: > Tull used to really be hot back in the early 70’s…
I like most periods of Tull, except This Was, and the Warchild/Minstrel/Too Old to R&R period. I actually love the electronic period, because that was Ian on steroids. I know its hard for some to like, but his songwriting was as sharp as ever, and it was the last album whit his voice intact the harmonic vocabulary did a backflip and they started using some interesting stacks of notes that made thing interesting–I think they had some quartal harmony going on. Then A was just a wicked fierce fusion album with good lyrics and everyone playing their asses off. > I know little of Fripps geetar > work.
Utterly unmatched in approach. A true innovator. I’ve heard some Mahavishnu that I think maybe rubbed off on Fripp, but Fripp has taken the guitar into so many places, its amazing. > But I was a great fan of their drummer. I always liked that > crisp ultra precise type drumming he had. "Yes" was the same way..
Same dude. Bill Bruford is godlike too. > Always good drumming..For the most part drumming sucks these days.
Cuz people decide disco and funk were gonna do more for music than the arty strains that the prog guys had. I think the electronic drumming on Tull’s Under Wraps is more interesting than a lot of things from that period–live or programmed, and is far more imaginative and dynamic than most stuff today. > I hear some stuff from a band called "Tool" I > think it is??? They have a song I taped called "aenama" or something > like that. Some decent drums on that song. One of the few new "rock" > bands I hear that seem to have a drummer that’s actually alive.
Tool is one of the only bands keeping the flame. Danny Carey is a fan of Billy Cobham, and has the chops too. > Even > Tull had pretty good drums. IE:aqualung…I always liked the late > attack on that song.
Damn straight. Barriemore Barlow was Tull’s drumming at its best. Imaginative, orchestral, unique. Clive Bunker could groove and swing, and had a great feel. I gotta go… More later e http://tapkae.com Cooler than sh*t!
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I don’t especially like Slipknot as such, I can listen to it, I just think > that it’s the most fun to play to, and that they have the best drummer in > existence. > First off, let me say that I haven`t acctually heard Slipknot (I am > downloading sumthin by them now), and I shouldn`t really say that comment. I > just think that there are too many non-musical aspects of them. > I just hate that whining guitar sound and droning vocals in all > the above mentioned bands, and it annoys me so much I just can’t come to > feel the passion of the songs because they do my head in so much, but if > you > want to hear the song which IMO is the most brilliant example of despair, > and putting your soul into your music, then get Anna Begins by Counting > Crows. If this song doesn’t move you then seek help and get a soul. > 
> I always liked Chelsea by the same band better. A beautiful tune. Adam > Duritz is a really good singer, and a purty allright songwriter. I love it > when he sings "I have trouble acting normal". Good to know that I`m not the > only one 
> If you dig heavier music, check out a norwegian *insert whatever fits, I`m > not too knowledgeable about metal genres*-metal called Ulver. Maybe not too > interesting from a drummer`s viewpoint, but the music is brilliant. > If you don`t like White Stripes than that is really up to you, there`s > nothing I can do about it. I`m just saying that they have a lot to say. And > that`s more than most of today`s selling bands have.
Drifting slightly off the original topic, if you like bands "that have a lot to say", you should check out System Of A Down, they say a fair bit. Zo
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may > not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into it. > For me, hitting > 16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, > BOSTON, KISS, > JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and > ability, > but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP, > PISTOLS, DAVE EDMUNDS. > And many bands fall somewhere in between. > Now, someone with a PHD in music Psychology tell me why I preferred one group > over the other. > Anyway, good luck to all the folks playing live out there. It can be a bitch. > Alvin Einstine
I hear you. I think it has to do with that old saying that music is supposed to tell a story, and if you don’t have a story to tell you shouldn’t be playing. Or, alternately, you join one of those Dream Theater-esque musicians-for-musicians wank-bands. I actually found that as a musician, and especially since I began producing and composing, I find it more and more difficult to sit down and just listen to music, without having to analyze the crap out of it. I’ll be sitting on the couch with the wife, she’ll be talking about how much she likes this tune, and all I can think of is "Wow, that bass sounds like an Oberheim 8-voice… Is that a Jupiter 6 in the chorus?" Stuart McConaghy Proud endorser and dealer of Canopus Drums http://severance.iuma.com "When the first thing existed, I was there waiting. When the last living thing dies, my job will be finished. I’ll put the chairs on the tables, turn out the lights, and lock the universe behind me when I leave." – Death
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> As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into
it. I wouldn’t say I "hate" a talented group or musician, but I’ve certainly heard tunes, songs, and styles of music that either did nothing for me, or made me think "This music SUCKS!". I suppose the people making that music are "expressing" themselves on a level I just don’t understand. (Or it really *does* suck!) I’ve also heard music from other cultures that, although I can understand and appreciate it, I just don’t care for it. As for the "compass" aspect of music, I suppose I’m somewhat of a drifter or vagabond in that regard. Although I have favorite artists and styles, I wander off in different directions as a result of my mood. Maybe it’s because I listened to a variety of music growing up. My folks listened to Glenn Miller, Chet Atkins, Johann Strauss, Perry Como, Bing Crosby, Enoch Light, Herb Alpert, Ray Coniff, and others. Instead of having a TV on, there was often something playing on the Hi-Fi (yeah, I’m "that" old). I’d have to say that the first "pop" group that really got my attention was The Beatles, in 1964. That was also not long after we got a "family" guitar; a $75 Kay solidbody. That guitar was the turning point for me. After the novelty wore off for everyone else, I still loved picking out melodies on it. I started hearing more & more Pop and Rock-n-Roll on the radio, and I wanted to play it. Over the years I realized there is a lot of music that I really enjoy playing, not so much because of how it "sounds", but because of how it makes me "feel". It can be the melody, the lyrics, the chord progressions, or the whole piece, but whatever it is, it evokes emotion in me. I’ve played Rock, Pop, Country, Folk, Cowboy, Celtic, Classical, Spiritual, Gospel, European Folk and probably some others, kind of like a musical "Around the World in 49 Years" adventure. All of it (if you’ll forgive the pun) has struck a chord in me. If I were to define "True North" on my musical compass, I suppose it would be acoustic guitar/vocal ballads. That’s the thing I gravitate toward to calm and soothe my soul. Everything else is a day trip or extended vacation in whatever direction I choose to travel. This is all probably more than you intended, Einstine, but hey: You asked! Monte
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I turned 16 in 1967, have a Ph.D. in Psychology, and I totally agree with your band listings. Can I explain it? Nope! It just is……
> As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into
it. For me, hitting > 16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, BOSTON, KISS, > JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and ability, > but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP, > PISTOLS, DAVE EDMUNDS. > And many bands fall somewhere in between. > Now, someone with a PHD in music Psychology tell me why I preferred one
group over the other. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Anyway, good luck to all the folks playing live out there. It can be a bitch. > Alvin Einstine
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LOL Man, I hate the groups you like (except the Who) but like the groups you hate. One of my turnons as a listener is talent. I love bands like Dream Theater, Kansas, or guitarists like Eddie Van Halen that show off their shit. Some sound better than others when they show off and maybe some try to get too technical but personally that is what I like to hear. That is probably why I got into fusion and instrumental metal. Some can have a good mix of emotion and complexity. I just saw a live video of Deep Purple with Steve Morse. Their playing and sound was super-emotional and Morse and Lord were playing some great complex parts. A good mix. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into it. For me, hitting > 16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, BOSTON, KISS, > JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and ability, > but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP, > PISTOLS, DAVE EDMUNDS. > And many bands fall somewhere in between. > Now, someone with a PHD in music Psychology tell me why I preferred one group over the other. > Anyway, good luck to all the folks playing live out there. It can be a bitch. > Alvin Einstine
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I’m mostly a jazz guy myself. Listening to Ornette Coleman as I write this. But Art Blakey and the Jazz Messengers really do it for me. And I’m still a huge Jaco freak. Dale – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we > may not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into > it. For me, hitting > 16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, > BOSTON, KISS, > JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills > and ability, > but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP, > PISTOLS, DAVE EDMUNDS. > Is it OK if I don’t much care for *any* of the above? > (I could argue about the "skill" involved in some of > those bands, but y’all would call me a Jazz Snob, > and I’m not. Mostly. ;-) Let’s just say that, regardless > of "skill" level (which I can certainly recognize) those > groups just don’t play the kind of stuff I’m looking > for. Put on a Paul Desmond side and I’m in Seventh > Heaven. Grady Tate. Kenny Burrell. Joe Pass. > All the kickass organists, of course – Smith, Holmes, > Earland, MacDuff, McGriff, DeFrancesco, etc. Other > groups? Hmmm…a little harder. Mostly older stuff… > Motown, certainly. BS&T. The Electric Flag. Steely > Dan. Gladys Knight and the Pips. Aretha, absolutely. > (Anyone heard her version of "Doctor Feelgood? YeeeOW!) > Ray Charles. Edgar Winter/White Trash. Joe Cocker. > Maria Muldaur. (She did some stuff with Dr. John that > was excellent, too.) I’m mostly looking for something > outside the standard 3-chord 4/4 box when I’m ready to > listen. And that’s the name of *that* tune. ;-) > Lord Valve > Eclectic
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I hate the White Stripes. I just can’t see the current trend of these > bands, > like the Strokes, the White Stripes and the Hives (the worst of the lot, > my > most passionately hated band). If you can’t sing, then don’t sing, don’t > try > disguise it by singing through a blues harmonica microphone, and that > droning guitar sound is enough on its own to make me want to drown myself. > Don’t ask why I hate them so much, since I don’t know, but they are the > three worst bands of recent times IMO. > Sez the guy who likes Slipknot > The White Stripes isn`t about holding tempos and singing in tune. The energy > that is in that band is truly beautiful. Check out their version of Jolene. > That despair is so much more real than just about anything else ever played. > And energy and soul is the most important aspects in music (if you ask me).
I don’t especially like Slipknot as such, I can listen to it, I just think that it’s the most fun to play to, and that they have the best drummer in existence. I just hate that whining guitar sound and droning vocals in all the above mentioned bands, and it annoys me so much I just can’t come to feel the passion of the songs because they do my head in so much, but if you want to hear the song which IMO is the most brilliant example of despair, and putting your soul into your music, then get Anna Begins by Counting Crows. If this song doesn’t move you then seek help and get a soul. Zo
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> I don’t especially like Slipknot as such, I can listen to it, I just think > that it’s the most fun to play to, and that they have the best drummer in > existence.
First off, let me say that I haven`t acctually heard Slipknot (I am downloading sumthin by them now), and I shouldn`t really say that comment. I just think that there are too many non-musical aspects of them. > I just hate that whining guitar sound and droning vocals in all > the above mentioned bands, and it annoys me so much I just can’t come to > feel the passion of the songs because they do my head in so much, but if you > want to hear the song which IMO is the most brilliant example of despair, > and putting your soul into your music, then get Anna Begins by Counting > Crows. If this song doesn’t move you then seek help and get a soul.
I always liked Chelsea by the same band better. A beautiful tune. Adam Duritz is a really good singer, and a purty allright songwriter. I love it when he sings "I have trouble acting normal". Good to know that I`m not the only one If you dig heavier music, check out a norwegian *insert whatever fits, I`m not too knowledgeable about metal genres*-metal called Ulver. Maybe not too interesting from a drummer`s viewpoint, but the music is brilliant. If you don`t like White Stripes than that is really up to you, there`s nothing I can do about it. I`m just saying that they have a lot to say. And that`s more than most of today`s selling bands have. > Zo
-k
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> Jethro Tull and King Crimson have kept me interested. I keep discovering > stuff every time I hear this stuff. And I haven’t even heard all KC.
Tull used to really be hot back in the early 70’s…They were pretty much the "hot" band back when I was in about 8-9th grade. "71-72" I’ve forgot half their stuff because I don’t hear too much any more. I was a drummer back when KC was really hitting it, and have always thought of them from a drummers point of view. I know little of Fripps geetar work. But I was a great fan of their drummer. I always liked that crisp ultra precise type drumming he had. "Yes" was the same way.. Always good drumming..For the most part drumming sucks these days. To me, very few have any drum imagination any more.They all sound like a pack of cloned bangers. I hear some stuff from a band called "Tool" I think it is??? They have a song I taped called "aenama" or something like that. Some decent drums on that song. One of the few new "rock" bands I hear that seem to have a drummer that’s actually alive. Even Tull had pretty good drums. IE:aqualung…I always liked the late attack on that song. MK
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> I hate the White Stripes. I just can’t see the current trend of these bands, > like the Strokes, the White Stripes and the Hives (the worst of the lot, my > most passionately hated band). If you can’t sing, then don’t sing, don’t try > disguise it by singing through a blues harmonica microphone, and that > droning guitar sound is enough on its own to make me want to drown myself. > Don’t ask why I hate them so much, since I don’t know, but they are the > three worst bands of recent times IMO.
Sez the guy who likes Slipknot The White Stripes isn`t about holding tempos and singing in tune. The energy that is in that band is truly beautiful. Check out their version of Jolene. That despair is so much more real than just about anything else ever played. And energy and soul is the most important aspects in music (if you ask me). peace, -k
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Skills and technical ability often comes at the expense of groove. I think that is why most technical bands are less popular than some of their simpler counterparts.
> As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ > their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into
it. For me, hitting > 16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, BOSTON, KISS, > JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and ability, > but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP, > PISTOLS, DAVE EDMUNDS. > And many bands fall somewhere in between. > Now, someone with a PHD in music Psychology tell me why I preferred one
group over the other. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Anyway, good luck to all the folks playing live out there. It can be a bitch. > Alvin Einstine
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>As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ >their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into
it. That’s why I’ve pretty much stopped entering into most debates about which bands rule and which bands suck, life is too short to spend time telling other people how the music they like is actually horrible. It’s a matter of taste, and just because I didn’t care for most big-hair spandex stadium bands doesn’t mean they weren’t real good at what they did, simply that I didn’t care for it. >For me it was the STONES, NEIL YOUNG, THE WHO, DYLAN, HENDRIX, ZEP,
Not to mention Coltrane and the Kinks and Miles and Rory Gallagher and Mozart and Muddy and SRV and traditional Japanese koto music if it comes to that, don’t ask me where I came by my tastes, it’s quite a mix. >Now, someone with a PHD in music Psychology tell me why I preferred one
group over the other. Originality counts a lot for me, bands that sound like clones of someone else automatically drop off my playlist for the most part. And although a good stadium show with all the FX is something to see, if the music can’t be played in a 150-seat roadhouse, if it *needs* the stagecraft to get over, sorry, next; that leaves out a lot of the current nu-metal with the guys in goofy masks etc, puhlease. Not to mention a lack of pretension, some terrific bands (say U2) who always seem to be about to break into a political lecture tend to alienate me. And musicians who don’t know where they came from, who have no roots, I find it hard to respect them, since they don’t seem to respect anyone else.
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>As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ >their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went into it. For me, hitting >16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, BOSTON, KISS, >JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and ability, >but their songs never lit the fire in my belly.
I have always respected Rush, although their sound simply does not appeal to me (and Geddy Lee’s voice is a take-it-or-leave-it thing). Besides that, one widely-heralded band that I just don’t like that much is the White Stripes; I love the energy, but when I listened to their latest album it sounded just a touch too unrefined and tempos were noticeably inconsistent. For that matter, the Guess Who and Led Zeppelin have never been my cup of tea. I admit, listening to their music you can *feel* their greatness… but alas, I’ll stick to my XTC and Wilco anyday. Richard
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>As musicians, do we really ever hate any truly talented bands? Though we may not ‘like’ >their album, or their style, we always appreciate the skill that went
into it. For me, hitting >16 in about 1977, to this day I do not like to listen to TOTO, KANSAS, BOSTON, KISS, >JUDAS PRIEST, VAN HALEN and on and on. I completely respect their skills and ability, >but their songs never lit the fire in my belly. > I have always respected Rush, although their sound simply does not > appeal to me (and Geddy Lee’s voice is a take-it-or-leave-it thing). > Besides that, one widely-heralded band that I just don’t like that much > is the White Stripes; I love the energy, but when I listened to their > latest album it sounded just a touch too unrefined and tempos were > noticeably inconsistent.
I hate the White Stripes. I just can’t see the current trend of these bands, like the Strokes, the White Stripes and the Hives (the worst of the lot, my most passionately hated band). If you can’t sing, then don’t sing, don’t try disguise it by singing through a blues harmonica microphone, and that droning guitar sound is enough on its own to make me want to drown myself. Don’t ask why I hate them so much, since I don’t know, but they are the three worst bands of recent times IMO. Zo
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